Thumbhole vs Standard

[thelefthand]

For those who have shot both the thumbhole stocks and the standard stocks, do you notice any improvement in accuracy, or group locations with the thumbhole as apposed to the standard stock?

I've shot thumbhole stocks on a lot of guns, and I love them. In fact only 3 of my guns don't have a thumbhole stock yet. My Savage has the original tupperware stock on it. It shoots good groups, but I've noticed that the groups like to move around on me from one shooting session to the next. The movement is side to side, which makes me think that maybe I'm not getting the rifle in the pocket the same way from one day to the next. It's no big deal on paper, but it stinks when it happens in the woods. So far it hasn't cost me a deer, but that's no excuse. I've wanted to get a thumbhole stock for it for years anyway, but I've never put it as a real high priority. I'm wondering if the thumbhole stock will help me shoulder the weapon more consistantly.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

[Rifleman]

Mark the drift might be as much from the non bedded action as it is from your shooting. But effect on the shooters end can be negated much by pulling the rifle straight back in the pocket, firm grip on the rifle, good cheek weld, etc.
Ozark- fix this fella up, I gotta run.

[PPosey]

For me thumbholes are great for target shooting and sitting in a stand but for still hunting/stalking I prefer a standard stock, they just carry better for me. And yep a thumbhole could tighten your groups if it improves your technique.

[Rifleman]

Ambidextrous, sporter thumbhole, 1 3/4" forend, designed as a carry thumbhole to accept sporter and varmint barrels.
Painted/Complete 293.50
Unpainted 226.50
Money Saver 156.50


www.stockadegunstocks.com/stocks/pricing.html

[ozark]

Tupperwear stocks are great for the hunter who creeps and crawls because it is rugged and can take a lot of punishment. That type of hunting normally means taking shots at close range where a bit of bullet spraying doesn't mean much. You love the thumbhole stocks so I say put one on the Savage. Changing from session to session could be caused by so many things I wouldn't attempt to pinpoint any cause. Bedding, sighting equipment, shooting techniques, shooting from different positions and it goes on and on. The thumbhole type stocks that I have shouldered and cheeked lifted my eye considerably above the bore compared to the other stocks. This feature in my case caused me to install the scope higher. The distance from the shoulder pocket to eye level differs among people. Get what you like best. You only pass through here once. Ben

[PPosey]

Have you bedded the action on that stock with the shifting poi

[jims]

I have two thumbhole stocks, one on the Sav and one on a slug TarHunt. They have their place but I personally like a standard stock better. Again I think it is all personal preference.

[petev]

I am a little confused about the question of bedding the action and adding a third pillar. Isn't the action, barrel and scope all one in that they are connected, so why would the stock affect accuracy? Along this line, I think Ive seen it suggested that removing and replacing the front trigger guard bolt to remove the bolt might change the point of impact. Can someone explain this? I would appreciate it. Thanks

[ozark]

Expaining it completely would be like writing a book. Your question is a fair one and I will briefly point you in a learning direction. Your feet and your boots become one about as much as the barreled action and the stock. Fit is important if you expect to use them together. Bedding is the fit between the two and can be good or extremely poor. This fit can cause all sort of accuracy issues. You can learn much about this by reading the tips and hints section at the top of this forum. It is not necessary to know how to do this yourself. Any competent gunsmith can do this for you for a very reasonable fee. The ordinary over the counter, or shipped rifle, is a production model and may or may not be accurate. You cannot get a custom fitted rifle at production prices. Hope this gets you at least to the door of learning. Ben

[PPosey]

If the action is not bedded to the stock then there is wiggle room, this alows the action to move around and put stress on different points, also allows temp and humidity to put stress on the action by effecting the stock. Ozark is right it would be a book. Lotsa post on here though that deal with bedding a ML2 removing the trigger bolt, if it is not tightened exactly back to the same pressure as before again the action will be stressed in a slightly different way and this will cause a change in shooting, bedding the action helps with this as well

[jims]

Ozark I like your analogy to boots. I have never heard it described that way before but it makes alot of sense.

[petev]

Well, you're all saying the same thing so my judgement tells me you're probably right, although it hasnt clicked for me yet. My original question was that I didnt know why play or whatever in the stock had to do with accuracy, if you had the crosshairs steady on the target, since the barrel, action and scope are all one, I think at least (not the stock though). I'll have to ponder it some more, find out more about glass bedding, and take it from there. I live out in the sticks, but theres a gunsmith here who is exceptional I think, so maybe I'll run it by him. I'm beginning to think that owning the Savage compared to owning a Hawken, is that the Hawken was turned out assembly line fashion for the masses, like the Model T, whereas the Savage is a scientific experiment until you get it right, and then you have a real purebred of a rifle.

[ozark]

petev. As you ponder this issue, I think you need to take it one step deeper. You line the scope up and squeeze the trigger. All looks well and you expect a good hit. But, you are holding on to the stock only (trigger excepted). Recoil begins moving things before the bullet exits the barrel and unless the stock and the shooter absorbs this movement the same with each shot the bullets will not impact in the same place. If you agree with my statement then it could help you understand what is happening and why bedding is important. If you are among those who thinks that recoil begins afte the bullet has seperated from the muzzle then my effort to assist you will be useless. Ben

[petev]

And there was light! Now it makes sense. Thanks Ozark. Moving right along, this issue has not come up with the centerfire rifles as far as I've heard. Not that it doesnt occur in centerfire, but is the Savage more susceptible to bedding problems because of the kick of this particular gun, or the stock? I do notice that I can bend the front end of the stock, which of course I could not do with the wooden stocks of my other guns. I have had some cherry wood drying for a year with the intent of making a stock, but that isnt on the project list just yet. Thanks again.

[thelefthand]

My tupperware stock has been bedded using Devcon F2. The fit is excellent.

I've found that I like to carry the standard stock more than the thumbhole, but regardless of the conditions I like to shoot the thumbhole better than the standard. So since the purpose of the tool is to shoot I think I'll get thumbhole and then put a good sling on it I can get a basic walnut thumbhole stock for $115 plus shipping, or a laminate for $135 plus shipping. I think I'm going to go with the laminate for extra rigidity and to reduce the sensitivity to moisture.

Petev, your centerfire rifles have this same issue. My 25-06 would hold 1" groups at 100yds when I first got it. After bedding the action, it now shoots well under 1/2" at 100 yds. On a really good day it will hold 1/2" at 200 yds. I don't think I've ever seen a situation where I would not have recommended that a person have their action bedded. I've gotten to the point that I just do it before I even shoot the gun.

Thanks,
Mark