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Post by Rifleman on Jul 7, 2004 14:34:25 GMT -5
I have a couple questions in regards to bullets for the savage.
1. IN regards to the Hornady .358 180 gr spire point, I saw RB did some work testing these, is this gonna be a viable option as I think RB is right, this may be one of the best choices considering factory twist is only 1/24. Is the sabot insert gonna be available?
2. IN regards to the 200 gr hornady sst. The only one that I have seen for sale is listed as a 45 cal bullet in a 50 cal. sabot, but I keep seeing a 40 cal 200 gr sst being mentioned. Are there 2 sst's in 200 gr available or are these maybe misprints in the catalog I have ?
3. In regards to the 40 cal 200 gr sst, and the sabots being worked up by rb, what is the sabot that is the basis for this project?
4. With the limitations set on us by twist rate in the savage, doesn't a 375 make a lot of sense ? Has anyone done anywork on these yet?
Thanks for any advise, Rifleman
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Post by simonkenton on Jul 7, 2004 15:19:34 GMT -5
I believe that 200 Shockwave and 200 SST are being used interchangably. They are the same bullet, both made by Hornady, the Shockwave is sold by Thompson Center and has a yellow tip, SST has a red tip.
I have not seen the 200 SST but I have been using the 200 Shockwave in .40, I buy them from Cabelas. It comes with a sabot.
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Post by SW on Jul 7, 2004 21:13:58 GMT -5
Rifleman: Hornady makes this bullet for itself(SST) and for TC(Shockwave). I believe it is only marketed for 50cal under the TC(Shockwave) label. It has a blue MMP sabot which needs re-enforcement as discussed on this web site in numerous places. I've gotten good results with the MMP,glued sabot to slightly above 2700"/sec. The rate of acceleration is a big factor - to help prevent drilling of the bullet thru the sabot. The washer method sounds very good.Occasionally, blemished Shockwaves/SSTs can be found from certain suppliers such as Mid South Shooters Supply,etc. .I've gotten both 250& 200g bullets this way. The 200g bullets I paid 15 cents each and the sabots are 12 cents each or 27 cents each vs appx 45cents each regular. Not a huge savings but some. They come w/o sabots which I purchase from MMP.
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Post by SW on Jul 7, 2004 21:18:01 GMT -5
Rifleman, Correction - 6.1Cents each for the bullets not 15 cents. So a total of 18cents each w/o the needed subbase.
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Post by simonkenton on Jul 7, 2004 22:38:21 GMT -5
Yeah, don't shoot 'em without a glued on sub base.
I fired some with 43 gr of 5744 and was treated to the sight of an exploding sabot.
I fired and saw a blue blizzard in front of my rifle. It wasn't pretty. I found a few of the pieces and they were little.
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Post by Rifleman on Jul 8, 2004 7:39:03 GMT -5
So is the 200 gr shockwave/sst a 40 cal projectile or a 45cal> what is the actual bullet diameter of the projectile or is it available in both 40 and 45 cal?
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Post by herman on Jul 8, 2004 7:48:48 GMT -5
SW did you find the shockwave blem on their web page?
I have looked and did several searchs and have not found them yet.
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Post by RBinAR on Jul 8, 2004 8:30:50 GMT -5
Posted by: rifleman Posted on: Today at 07:39:03
So is the 200 gr shockwave/sst a 40 cal projectile or a 45cal> what is the actual bullet diameter of the projectile or is it available in both 40 and 45 cal?
;DBoth the SST and Shockwave are .40 caliber in 200 grains weights and both are made by Hornady. The only difference is the SST has a red tip and the Shockwave has a yellow tip.
The yellowed tipped Shockwave comes supplied with a .50/40 caliber blue sabot that will fit in the 10-ML or any sabot shooting .50 caliber rifle.
The red tipped SST is NOT sold with a .50 caliber sabot under any condition. It only comes with a .45/40 caliber sabot. So it's the same bullet different sabot.
Because of the way they are packaged and the price shooters have found it is cheaper to buy the SST anyway and then add the blue sabot from MMP. T/C gets about $10 for 15 Shockwaves with the blue sabot. You can get 200 SSTs for $7.17 and the extra sabots
are $3. This is the reason so many look for the blemed Shockwaves because they are cheap and shooters are used to supplying a sabot to this bullet anyway.
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Post by simonkenton on Jul 8, 2004 8:52:00 GMT -5
I tried some more 200 Shockwaves with the glued on MMP sub bases this morning. I was shooting 43 grains of N110.
The first shot was good, 2 inches high at 100 and a little right. The second shot was ten inches right! I found the sabot, it cracked a little in the center, so it was a borderling blow out.
I think with 42 or 41 gr of N110 this would shoot pretty well.
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Post by Rifleman on Jul 8, 2004 9:24:35 GMT -5
RB thanks once again for squaring me away before I spent the money, I'll tell you what guys I have saved a bunch of money just by the great advice I receive on this board, Thanks Rifleman
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Post by edge on Jul 8, 2004 9:46:10 GMT -5
RB thanks once again for squaring me away before I spent the money, I'll tell you what guys I have saved a bunch of money just by the great advice I receive on this board, Thanks Rifleman With 15,000 Savage rifles out there, I do wonder where the average person does get this information? I do think that most of the Savage owners that visit this and Ol' Green are satisfied, but what about the others, are they happy they made the choice for smokeless or are they just shooting BP and 777 in their Savages? I have had the Model I & Model II, and for being a new product on the market I would have thought that Savage would have sent out a questionaire to see how their product was doing, BUT Nooooo! Hmmmm.....are you listening Savage? Probably not :-( edge. |
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Post by Rifleman on Jul 8, 2004 10:45:21 GMT -5
OK the 200 gr sst/shockwave is a 40 cal projectile, got that. But if you use a MMP blue sabot, that is not a sabot designed for a 50 cal bore. so what is the deal, how does this work?
Rifleman
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Post by grouse on Jul 8, 2004 10:47:36 GMT -5
OK the 200 gr sst/shockwave is a 40 cal projectile, got that. But if you use a MMP blue sabot, that is not a sabot designed for a 50 cal bore. so what is the deal, how does this work? Rifleman There is a MMP blue sabot .40cal for a .50cal ML.  |
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Post by grnhornet on Jul 8, 2004 11:01:08 GMT -5
Edge, my only exposure to a steel and wood Savage ML before buying mine was during a special park hunt. My son and I came across two older gentlemen as we were walking out to our car. We stopped to inquire about their success. Which at that point one of them started chuckling about the others problems. He related that it is hard to kill a deer when the bullet just clears the barrel. I asked the down trodden fellow what he was using and he replied a Savage Muzzleloader. He then related that he had problems all day with the rifle. I figure that he sighted it in and that was the last that he shot it. There is a lot of uneducated muzzleloaders out there.
When I went to a gun dealer to check out some bullets for my new Savage MLII the dealer asked what I was going to use them in. When I told him, he started in about the propaganda of that they are a P.O.S. I spent a little time educating him on that subject!
This board has gone a long ways in selling and educating me on the MLII!
Thank You, and the board menbers, keep up the good work!
Savage, If you are reading this you are also doing a good job, BUT you need to improve your public relations and update you information on the muzzleloader to us.
Dave
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Post by edge on Jul 8, 2004 11:34:20 GMT -5
SNIP. I asked the down trodden fellow what he was using and he replied a Savage Muzzleloader. He then related that he had problems all day with the rifle. SNIP Before Savage came out with the Model-II, I bought the Model-I with the modules. I was trying to shoot .40 QT bullets with Alliant 2400, and it was an absolute nightmare! I sent the rifle back to Savage complaining about misfires AND I SENT THEM THE BULLETS!!! I asked them to shoot MY LOAD, and make sure it would fire. They didn't, and just said that there was nothing wrong with the rifle, and NOTHING about the bullets that I was using! I did get them to shoot accurately, but no thanks to Savage! I do know that there are alot of people that bought their Savage VERY cheaply due to unhappy EX-Savage ownwers. Good news travels not nearly as fast as BED NEWS! edge. |
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Post by Rifleman on Jul 8, 2004 12:19:07 GMT -5
OK we are getting there, the 200 gr, 40 cal sst/shockwave should be fired with a blue 50 cal od/ 40 cal id mmp sabot. (high pressure designation I suppose)
MMP nor Midsouth shooters supply show these on their respective websites. Where do you get them and what is the item/part number?
Thanks again, Rifleman
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Post by bubba on Jul 8, 2004 12:38:18 GMT -5
call mmp, they have lots that is not on their website.
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Post by bubba on Jul 8, 2004 12:38:40 GMT -5
call prbullet.com, they may also carry them.
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Post by simonkenton on Jul 8, 2004 13:19:40 GMT -5
Rifleman you can buy the 200 Shockwave from Cabelas. You get 30 bullets for $15, they come with a blue sabot that I assume is the same MMP sabot.
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Post by SW on Jul 8, 2004 13:48:27 GMT -5
I found 2100 200 "Shockwaves" on the bargain part of Mid South, and from past e xperience, ordered immediately. $130 + shipping for 2100 200g red tipped(SST) bullets. Past Blems have always been Shockwaves,as these were advertized. The red is prettier to me anyway. These are the worst blems I've ever gotten - many tips not straight, but most are. I think the only place you can get the blue 40/50 sabot will be MMP. Also, I think the straight V V-110 load of even low 40ish wts will not respond as well as a slower powder(120) with the 3-hole or a good gentle(in This Heat) duplex. My 1st two shots with 15 min between are within 1 bullet diameter of each other virtually everytime.
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