Where should I aim?

[ozark]

I shoot from a padded window rest. My deer is nearly always 100 yards or less. I don't shoot at moving deer and can place my bullets from my .243 consistently within a four inch circle under deer killing conditions. I have no desire to save the antlers for mounting regardless of size or spread. I am thinking of aiming where the head joins the neck on opportunities that I am sure of hitting the mark. Or, take a brain shot if the deer is facing me. Naturally, If for some reason I had doubts I could take a lung/heart shot. But with my situation would not a head or the neck/head connection be advisable? I have intentionally made head shots on both deer and bear with no failures. No, I wouldn't break a jaw and let the deer starve to death. Any encouragement or comments like: Don't be stupid? Ben

[rossman40]

I like to aim where the neck meets the body, but that is with my 10ML. If the deer decides to drop his head to graze then it is not as critical. Of course you can be a lot more surgical with the .243 and you know how the deer act after watching them all year. The reason I like neck shots is the deer drops right there and isn't pumped full of adrenalin after a "death dash". With a head shot if you miss it usually a clean miss and you get another chance maybe next year.

[wilmsmeyer]

I'm tempted here to urinate on everyones cornflakes with the way I feel on head shots/neck shots on deer. But I will try and be diplomatic.

Each situation is different. However, shooting at a very small target such as a deers brain or vertebrae is a test that involves skill/understanding and luck. Skill and understanding can be obtained. Anyone who shoots 1 inch groups at 100 yds with a rifle and understands how this translates to feild accuracy.....understands the immediate situation at hand...knows the animals demeanor while aiming and that may give one confidence.

Deer are quirky and jerky. The head and neck move and change places the most as it feeds, chews, listens and reacts to its' surroundings. I would not be surprised if a skilled marksman were successful 90% of the time under 100 yds with a rifle. Reaction time of a well squeezed shot, coupled with the jerky nature of a deer and TOF of a bullet can all equel a grazing shot in worst case scenarios IMO when trying to hit a 2-3 inch target.

However, do as you may. The understanding part may take care of where you eventually aim. A 10 inch circle that doesn't wobble much makes the most sense to this seasoned deer killer. A dead deer is a dead deer whether it runs 100yds very mortally wounded or drops on the spot. I don't gamble much at casino's...don't play lotto..and generally aim for the spot where lungs and heart collide. Rarely am I dissappointed by my choices. I attribute this gravitating aiming point to 20 years of archery hunting that pays dividends every time it's tried.

Ozark...even the best shooters can not anticipate a head bob every single time IMO. Hopefully your cornflakes are still edible.

[ozark]

Actually I agree Wilms. However thinking about taking such a shot and taking it are sometimes different. If the deer is calm, and just standing looking at something I have aimed and taken the head shot. Naturally, if there is appears to be any chance of a foulup I would take the heart lung shot. The very first deer I ever took was a headshot with a .22 long rifle.
Over and over my older brother had told me to shoot just back of the foreleg. I was told to follow a trail up a ridgeline while he went parallel to me along the side of the ridge. One of us mights spook a deer to the other. I was more afraid of getting separated from him than caring about killing a deer. The trail twisted and turned through underbrush and larger trees as I climbed to higer ground. I kept listening carefully for my brother to shoot or make noise in the woods when I heard something up ahead. I then seen glimpses of a deer coming along the trail toward me. I pulled back the hammer on the .22 and waited. The deer rounded a bend in the trail and stopped dead still looking at me. I had killed hogs for butchering with brain shots and I could not see the spot on the deer I had been told to hit. I put the beat between the eyes and shot. The deer flopped in the trail and just quivvered. My brother yelled wanting to know why I had shot. I told him I had shot a deer. He came running up asking which way it left. I showed him where it was laying. "My god, what a deer he remarked as he went to cut it's throat. It was a good ten pointer. It was a case of making an easy head shot or perhaps losing the deer. So, much depends of the shooter, the deer and what the situation is. Not much on contaminated cornflakes Wilms but if things looks right this old deer hunter will pull the trigger. Ozark
PS: Ofcourse you are correct as far as normal situations goes. Ben

[petev]

I'm sorry you guys but taking a shot a deer's head and where its neck meets the shoulder are two different things. One twitch of the deer and he may move his head just when you take the shot. Not so with the bottom of the neck. It's pretty much as steady as just behind the shoulder, and as Rossman says a shot in the neck will make the deer go right down, right there. The bottom of the neck is not that small an area, especially when you are using a caliber such as .243 with shocking power. Now try to sever a deer's jugular with an arrow, and see how far he doesnt go, that's a challenge. I've done it, once (lucky). Pete

[youp50]

Shot some in the head/neck, I do recall clipping the hairs off the neck of a nice buck. Really do not consider it, much anymore. Some times they are just peaking around a tree and all you get is a head shot. Shoot it in the head and eat the rest, or hold your shot and maybe eat chicken and burger all winter. I like venison.

I do not eat the ribs and do prefer that shot. I think that sooner or later everyone nicks a deer and fails to recover it. I think some deer recover from the wound. I think anyone that thinks it won't happen to them is only one trigger pull from reality.

I don't really like corn flakes, with or without condiments.

[wilmsmeyer]

3 years ago, my hunting partner shot a very nice non-typical (156 inch 15 point) Deer had 2 .22 LR bullets in the neck, half an arrow shaft in the shoulder and dozens of #6 size shot from one side of the neck down past the shoulder. The deer appeared healthy and none of the ordinance was from that season. His arrow went thru both lungs.

Yes they can survive bad hits. If just 1 of those 22 bullets had slipped between the ribs this deer would be in a poachers cellar and not my friends den.

[ozark]

Wow, amazing story of survival. I am curious, was the broadhead still embeded inside the deer? They are tough but I have never heard of one that tough. Ozark

[wilmsmeyer]

Ozark, Almost every big buck we have shot in the past 15-20 years has had ordinance in it. Good bucks are targeted by many bad people here and everywhere.

Deer are hearty and can soak up .22's and arrows when the impact area as not "vital" I'm sure it hurts and I'm sure it messes with their activity. But...they get through. I will say now that we are always surprised when we get a nice one and there are no previous hunting "injuries". Sad but true.

This info is really unrelated to the initial post and I am not relating it to taking neck or head shots. Just kind of veered into the subject.

2 years ago we were after an "OK" buck that was carrying an arrow that looked to have been placed behind the shoulder at a quartering away angle. The broadhead must have not penetrated enough. Most of us saw this buck, arrow hanging out, in a 2-3 week period. None of us could seal the deal. We wanted to because it just looked bad. He chased does, fed in fields and eluded hunters.

d**n...deer are tough buggers.

[ozark]

I guess our poachers recover their deer better here. I haven't heard of any with arrwo parts or bullets being found in deer that have been harvested. Under ideal conditions I would take a head or neck shot. As far as taking neck shots one needs to know where the spinal column is within the neck. Hit that with almost any browdhead or bullet and the deer will stay down. I have lost one deer during the last forty years. It was shot with a .357 Cal. S&W revolver just behing the shoulder. I followed to quickly because I read the blood trail as bring death in short order. I decided to never try a pistol on deer again and I haven't. Ben
I just remember. I lost one using a crowssbow also. To lose one is sickening for me.

[RAF]

Ozark, I'm pretty sure you can hit what you're aiming at especially with a 243. I wouldn't normally recomment a head shot to just anyone but I know you can make it. If the deer is standing there and give you the opportunity, take it and tell us how tasty it was .

[petev]

I thought some of you might find the picture below interesting. This is a shoulder blade (upside down) from a deer taken by a bowhunter friend about 20 years ago in Westchester County N.Y. The arrow, which was shot at least a year previous, had penetrated the shoulder blade, and left the broadhead underneath the shoulderblade, and then bone grew through the voids in the blades. The shaft was completely missing. Then the hunter who killed the deer (again by bow) found this odd combination when butchering it. Deer are amazingly tough. It gives you even more incentive to try to make a clean kill.

[whyohe]

ozark first off you know your abilities of shooting, and the fact that you actually have it better than most in that you have an in closed hut with a rest. i personally dont endorse head shots for most.

i'll tell you a little experiance. i was out hunting in rifle season when a group of 4 does come past me and dont stop. but they go in front of a nother hunter and he takes aim and they move before he shoots. one comes up in my area and presents a shot. i take it down deer. 5 seconds later a shot from the other hunter. i see him get down and i go to my deer. he walks up to me cause the deer goes on my father in laws property and he askes if he can track it i say sure he wont mind and offer my services to help. he accepts. i help him trail it. it was hard little blood but every once in a while a puff of blood spray. so i see it leads to a DENCE are a of tangle weeds. i tell him to wait there and ill go to the other side and push it out for him. wel long story short i see it 10n yards from me and wanting to go away from the guy. we had an earler agreement that if i could put ti down for him do it so i did.boiler room shot. i crawl in and pull it out and the lowe jaw is just haning there. be for he got there i asked where he aimed and he said i only take head shots. i told him he hit it in the jaw and he said he couldt have done that cause he never did it before. well i went back to get my deer and decidrd to trail back the does cause i saw all 4 clearly when they came past me and never saw the jaw hanging and there was no blood except where he shot.

i dont want to step on toes or say you shouldnt, but seeing that was an eye opener to me. that deer, if not harvested would have starved to death and i just dont want to take that chance.

[ozark]

Let me be clear that I would advise anyone to take head shots. I would never attempt one myself unless I was absolutely certain of placing the bullet within an inch of my point of aim. This means that I must be sure of the rifle accuracy, the ammo accuracy, the precise zero and assurance that the deers head is not moving. With that said I will state that I am able to aim carefully and can at any time prior to ignition back off. As deer walk by my hunting shack window I usually aim at various parts of the deer with no intent of shooting at all. I am just practicing my aiming technique. I get feedback from this practice of how steady I am, my wobble area. I would never tell another to try a head shot unless I knew them as well as I know myself. I seriously doubt that I will ever try for a head shot but I am very confident that With my .243, lifetime experience of hunting and over eleven years of full time exposure to competitive marksmanship that I would see complete success. But, I have past 80 and closer to 81 and nothing works as well as it did 45 years ago. Whyone, you sure haven't stepped on my toes. I should not have even mentioned that I might try that from my setup. Ozark.

[whyohe]

Ozark, you have been here long enough that we know you and your capabilities. if you can cleanly take the shot and you are confident, GO FOR IT. we can not tell you other wise. i beleave you can do it. . i however personally just dont want to take the chance. why not mention it? im sure there are others here that would do it too. i have finished deer with excellent head shots @ 30 yards. just not my first choice of shot.

[iowamuzzleloader]

Wow petev. Do you think liberal anti hunters "spiked" that deer like they do the big trees to deter logging?

Head, neck shots are low percentage and I don't know why you would take them if you can take a broadside double lung/heart shot. For fun? Because you can? Maybe.